Tough to Swallow
No Semin in Detroit.According to NHL.com, The Carolina Hurricanes signed Alexander Semin to a one year, $7 million contract.
And there goes another one.
"I'm very happy to be a Carolina Hurricane. It's a great fit for me. I look forward to playing with great players, and putting together a winning season." --Alexander Semin
Over paid? Not if he goes out and scores 40 goals next season...
Make the jump for more.
You may think I'm using hyperbole when I throw out 40 goals - but on a wing with Pavel Datsyuk or Henrik Zetteberg...who knows what Semin would have been able to accomplish. Would it be worth $7 million of Mr. Illitch's money? Maybe..we'll never know now.
"What would have been..."
Is that the byline to this off-season?
We thought that we could be the team that could get out of Semin what no one else could. We had Babcock to keep him motivated and Datsuyk to be his Russian buddy and set-up man.
When in the blue hell are we going to make another move?
I realize that I'm writing this from an angry place and I'm not going to presume to know more or better than Kenny Holland...but this is getting a little too frustrating.
Please refrain from using the words "swallow" and "Semin" in nearby sentences. This offseason has been hard enough.
Gavin R. Brandl - There is a top tear D-man, his name is Brendan Smith and will compete for the Calder next year. Will he be Lidstrom? F' no. But yeah.
There are so many teams that appear to be strong cup contenders that I can't think of one reason for a player to desire Detroit over those other teams.
And no, playing with Datsyuk and Zetterberg are not enough as there are plenty of teams with elite players in their lat 20's.
What I have noticed here, even if Detroit didn't go after Semin, is that players are no longer interested in Detroit. The grass looks much greener elsewhere.
I think the only hope we have at getting elite players is trade or offering "un-Red Wings" like contract amounts. It's a new environment out there and I almost feel that KH was just not expecting it too be this difficult to lure players.
Okay, this one I'm upset by. I understand cap strategy and keeping yourself flexible but this was a ONE YEAR DEAL!! Even if he totally sucks and starts dogging it, we can either try and trade him, thus reducing the 7M cap hit or just ride it out. At the end of the day, are there really going to be that many moves for us to make come trade deadline that we're going to wish he had a lower cap hit? Probably not. Now of course, perhaps he didn't want to play here. That's always a possibility so I will be interested to see if Kenny made an offer or was in contact with him. Or maybe Babs gave some input and said "Thanks, but no thanks." My one concern prior to his signing was that he would demand a multi year deal which would be like playing with fire but he signed a ONE YEAR DEAL! That is the perfect scenario for us! WTF!
For all the talk about Kenny and the CBA, I keep telling myself the same thing. He must know something we don't. But, let's not forget, if the two sides can't reach a deal, there's a very strong possibility that they will just sign a one year extension type contract that keeps the current CBA going until next year. Kind of like our nation's "debt ceiling" debate. In other words, even if the two sides can't agree, it doesn't mean a lockout is going to happen AND it was a one year deal!!! So, if they change and agree on a new CBA, what changes to the CBA could possibly affect a ONE YEAR DEAL! AHHH
Did I mention this was a ONE YEAR DEAL!?
You guys are griping about the wrong things. Detroits forward depth is fine. There is no sense overpaying on a gamble like semin. The holes are on defense. But the mistake isn't that Ken didn't land a top notch d man this summer, it is that he had done nothing to prepare for lidstrom retiring or Stuart leaving. Why is there no top tier d men in the pipeline ready to step in? For a team that prides itself on drafting and developing it is pretty embarassing. It can't be blamed on late draft picks either. Weber was taken 49th in his draft.
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Holland is waiting for the new CBA before making any moves. After the first day of free agency it was clear he was setting up the roster for a trade. That trade will happen but only after the new CBA. The fans wanted Semin far more than the Wings brass. He attempted Nash, he was never going to land Weber. Suter made a decision based of friendship, not hockey; nothing Holland can do to change that. I will not be surprised when we do not land Shane Doan. He will sign a third line defenseman close to training camp, and whenever this CBA crap gets sorted then the moves will come. I still think the Wings will look different on day 1 of next season than they do now. In Kenny we trust.
@JOHNxJOHN I totally agree. Three words...er letters..C.B.A. He knows a LOT MORE than we can ever hope and he's no dummy.
My whole gripe is now we are LESS of a team than the one that got smoked in the first round by Nashville. Not sure, and I am NOT a GM, but I too, do NOT understand this off-season......
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"Nothing ventured, nothing gained." If only Ken Holland hadn't been out with the flu on the day his kindergarten teacher taught that lesson...
We're not getting Doan, there are at least two teams ahead of us in terms of his interest. Semin would've taken less for a longer contract, especially to play with #13, but he was never given the chance, apparently the brass were never interested. For the first time in years we had money to spend and now it's just sitting there. What a crappy, crappy offseason. I would say I can't wait for the season to start, but if we're rolling this roster, I'm not thrilled.
Nice quote from the Malik responses:
"There is a huge, and I mean epic, difference between getting angry at your team, your team’s management or your team’s performance (on the power play, for instance) and “hurling yourself off the bandwagon.” Those of us who dare to criticize this team, George, are still Wing fans. And we’ve never been on a bandwagon, either."
I dont want to hear that Datsyuk or any of the other Wings would be able to "fix" Semin. Semin played along side one of the best Russians to ever play the game in Ovechkin and he still carries a bad rep. Because Datsyuk is Russian he would put him in line or show him the right way to play?!?!? Does anyone realize how ridiculous that sounds?! If he scores 40 goals for the 'Canes, then big deal, the last guy to score 40 goals for us...Hossa....remember him hoisting the Cu...oh yeah wait...we lost. The Wings spread the puck, everyone who plays hard gets their chances, we are a TEAM, not a couple of 40 goal scorers on a line wondering what the playoffs must be like. Do you really think that KH, Babs, etc. did not investigate further. Hell, maybe they asked Datsyuk and he confirmed he's a bad apple..We don't know.
We talk about this team and perhaps some of us have taken in a practice or have seen a player or two out on the town, but your crazy if you think that any of us know more about the team "needs" and "fits" over the management, coaches, and players. I'm sure they gave Semin a look, he just wasnt what they were "looking" for....
@tjmendiola I don't think a highly talented player like Semin enjoyed being referred to as "The other Alex." Datsyuk is a modest player and does not try to be the center of attention.
Ovetchkin is selfish, arrogant and a complete prima donna. Detroit is famous for turning players around so it's very possibly they could have. Plus if you look at Caps fans comments, they don't all agree with Pierre "douche canoe" McGuire.
Criticism is fair, especially if they aren't telling us all the facts about how hard they "looked".
@Reddy @tjmendiola I think there was a different Semin after the coaching change this year. He started asking to play on the PK, skating harder, etc. I would like to think that this glimmer is what could have been for us. However, we aren't a cap team and aren't going to be a cap team this year, so why not give him a try for 1 season? What can it possibly hurt unless he is worse than Cory Emmerton (which is hardly possible)?
@tjmendiola @ThroatShot After all the years of following the team I've earned the right to question what they do. I'm not more aware of the teams needs, but I can see the obvious ones that are so far unfulfilled. Blind faith is never a good thing, if everyone had it nothing would ever happen. Luckily not everyone does, some people ask questions.
@tjmendiola @Reddy The possibility that they ruin your room comes with anyone. If the problem arises, you deal with it. Worst case, we trade him to anywhere for a low round pick and he's gone. Heck, waive him if you have to. As I said above, nothing ventured, nothing gained.
@Reddy @ThroatShot There is certainly no evidence to suggest he's a cancer in the locker room but its a possibility. Just like it was a possibility he could have put on the winged wheel and scores lights out every night.
The staff knows more than any of us and they ultimately made a decision to not continue down that path. Do you really believe they did not investigate it
or that you are more aware of the team needs then they are?!?!!
After all the accolades the coaches and staff have received over the years, they've certainly earned the right to have the benefit of the doubt from me.
Its because of my utmost faith in them that I think they made a great decision to not sign Semin.
@tjmendiola @ThroatShot Then you obviously have even less faith in the coaching staff than anyone. I believe they could bring him into line (if he is even that bad which I doubt). He reads the media too, and given that it's taken him nearly a month to sign in a terrible market he wont let that happen again.
Plus theres no evidence to suggest he was a "cancer". The caps are a very different team to the wings, anyone that flourishes there has to content with captain arrogance. I doubt it was motivating for him.
@ThroatShot @Reddy He could become a cancer in the locker room...that would be a possibility of what could hurt. He could be a bad example to the younger skaters (and we are certainly more young than we have been in years!) Nyquist, Brunner, Tatar, Smith, etc.
I guess we can only be happy that him and Nash are both in the east... Would be nice if Ken actually DID SOMETHING this offseason tho...
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$7M is what he was probably seeking on a 1 year deal. For 2 years, we probably could have gotten him at less - say $5-6M. But, if you have the cap space and we desperately need a sniper (and a Right Handed one at that), $7M doesn't seem that risky on a 1-year deal.
@DetCapC19 Why would he have taken less on a 2 year deal? $5M?!?! , Where are you getting that # from? We have a right handed shot in Brunner that KH and Babs said will contend for a top 6 spot that we are just over $1M for...$7M was not the problem here, it was signing him in general. The Penguins, Rangers, Flyers, Blue Jackets, Coyotes, Devils...and on, and on, and on...all passed on this guy.
@tjmendiola @DetCapC19 Well, I think its naive to think that Brunner can produce at the level Semin can in his rookie year (not to mention, his first year on North American ice). I like the Brunner signing and I think he has some real potential, but if it doesn't work out, then what?
The $5M was just a number I put together. I think the reason he got $7m was because it was a 1 year deal. Both parties gave in to something (Semin in years, Carolina in money) to make it work. I could be wrong, but I don't think its out of the question that he would have taken less to have a multi-year deal.
You're right, lots of teams passed on him. But it could be that they're waiting on the Doan signing first. Perhaps Semin was their backup plan to Doan? I don't think its fair to outright assume that teams didn't sign him because of any ill will. Bylsma came out and said he'd like to have Semin. And Carolina said that they did their research and due diligence on him and once they did, they signed him to a 7M deal. Is it possible that their research proved that the stigma around Semin is a bit overblown?
I think comparing playing with Ovie to playing with Pav is like comparing apples to oranges.
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Good points.
I'm not saying the guy's a Saint, I'm just saying that he's worth the risk. In a BAD year, he scores 20 goals. Our PP needs a boost and we've got cap space. I'm not saying give the guy $7M but at the end of the day, we don't get to bank cap space. So if we've got it, and we can afford to use it, why not take a flier on a guy that we could probably use (talent wise).
Maybe there's more to this than we know. Maybe the Canes need this more than we do. Maybe KH thinks that he can get better deals by waiting out the new CBA. What I do know is that the merit of this decision will be determined by April and then re-evaluated again in June.
Datsyuk had only played with Kazan before he came over to Detroit, did anyone predict anything from him?
I agree its not fair to assume that teams didnt sign Semin out of a bad reputation alone, but then its also not fair to assume that he would be a 40 goal scorer with us either.
Perhaps the stigma around Semin is overblown and that Carolina may have done enough research to sign him, but then again they only signed him to a one year deal so what must their research say..why not sign for two, three, four, or five year deal? Teams may have been waiting on the Doan signing first but doesnt that speak volumes about what the scouting report on Semin is? Doan is a 35 year old who is closer to the end of a career and plays with heart. Semin is a 28 year old who should be in his prime, something doesnt seem to mesh.
It could be that the 'Canes needed to bring fans in to the stadium as well. They ranked 20th in the NHL for pct. of Capacity in 2009. Raleigh is not Detroit, they need to sell tickets. Small market.
@DetCapC19 @tjmendiola Brunner has only played in the European equivalent of beer leagues (Switzerland), so I'm not holding my breath. Sadly, he is probably our last great hope at a run this year.
